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Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

fletcher posted:

Krakkles, any reason you don't want to go down the ZFS route instead, using something like FreeNAS or NAS4Free?
Not that I know of. As long as it's "RAID6 like" in terms of protection (I'd like to be safe against 2/4 drives failing, because what I'm storing is very valuable to me. And yes, it will be copied offsite via crashplan, also.)

School me! Would either of these options support printer sharing? It's not a dealbreaker if not, but I'd prefer to have my N40L handling printer sharing so that I don't have to have my desktop on to print to it.

Krakkles fucked around with this message at 01:36 on Nov 17, 2012

evensevenone
May 12, 2001
Glass is a solid.

Caged posted:

I don't think any Windows can run off a USB stick because it resets the USB ports as it boots, or something like that. You could run ESXi off a USB stick but that's probably a bit overkill.

That was a problem with XP but not Windows 7 and up. (Don't know about Vista).

The only issue is that flash drives are slow and have poor write endurance.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

Krakkles posted:

Not that I know of. As long as it's "RAID6 like" in terms of protection (I'd like to be safe against 2/4 drives failing, because what I'm storing is very valuable to me. And yes, it will be copied offsite via crashplan, also.)

School me! Would either of these options support printer sharing? It's not a dealbreaker if not, but I'd prefer to have my N40L handling printer sharing so that I don't have to have my desktop on to print to it.
ZFS and RAIDZ2 is analogous to RAID6, allowing you to lose any two drives without data loss. You also can load a print-server on NAS4Free/FreeNAS. It's not as easy as just plugging it in, like in Windows, but it's not impossible. Here's a thread on one guy's method: http://forums.nas4free.org/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=212

Froist
Jun 6, 2004



Has anyone got any experience with Windows 8 Storage Pools and could help me make a decision?

I've got an N40L that's about 6 months old, running Ubuntu Server with ZFS and 4x2tb drives, that just ticks over every day as a media storage box with usenet tools. About a foot away I have a 5-year-old (but still going strong) Windows 7 Media Center box that runs as a PVR and streams any other media from the N40L.

Pushed into it by an impending house move, I've realised this is a bit wasteful and could (hopefully) be consolidated into the N40L doing both jobs in a smaller, neater and quieter package. I really like WMC so don't want to move to Ubuntu/MythTV, and it seems like for this use case Storage Pools should cover my needs as ZFS does now.

I've done some reading around and Storage Pools performance doesn't seem stellar, but past the initial data migration I don't think the poor write performance will matter for me as it's just a media playback device - I very rarely copy files to it across the network, it just ticks over and downloads things at its own pace overnight. It looks like read speed isn't too bad from a parity pool, only write speed is affected? And even if it is, it shouldn't be affected to the point it can't smoothly playback video? I also read it isn't great at adding storage to a parity pool later, but really 6tb should see me through for a long time (famous last words) - at the moment the total of my years of hoarding hasn't reached 3tb. The other up-side is that I'd feel a bit more secure with my data on a "supported" solution. ZFS just works, but I'm no linux expert and not confident in my abilities to save the data if a drive ever did die, whereas Storage Pools should be a bit easier.

Can anyone see any drawbacks that I'm missing, or does this seem a good idea? The only things stopping me trying it out are the investment in a new TV tuner (as the N40L only takes PCI-E) and the week's-worth of data shuffling to be able to clear the drives for a new install.

joe944
Jan 31, 2004

What does not destroy me makes me stronger.


New NAS is up and running. Had some compatibility issues with my onboard SATA controller and Openindiana so I ended up using FreeNAS again. New version has some nice features and as always is very painless to setup.

7.1 TB pool 25% used so far. Initial speed tests are promising.

rekamso
Jan 22, 2008


Really happy with the N40L for a home NAS. Super quiet, easy setup (at least with FreeNAS), and a nicely designed box.

Next step: stop using Lacie NAS boxes at work -- the transfer speeds are terrible compared to the cheaper N40L + FreeNAS alternative.

KS
Jun 10, 2003


Outrageous Lumpwad

Well, after buying an N40L, I think I'm going to look for something more powerful. My ECC RAM is registered and won't work, and I think I can get something more powerful for the same money given that I'd need to re-buy the RAM.

My goal is a 32GB machine with enough power to act as an ESX server, and VT-D support to pass the storage through to a ZFS VM.

I'm looking for a case and PSU recommendation that's similar size to the N40L, quiet, and can take 4 3.5" drives and an SSD. I'm going to put a Supermicro x8SIL-F in it since the newer X9s also only take unbuffered RAM, unless someone has a better suggestion.

I'm going to try to sell the N40L on SA Mart, I guess -- when did Newegg start charging a 15% restocking fee? I don't think I'm going to shop anywhere but Amazon from now on.

Moey
Oct 22, 2010

I LIKE TO MOVE IT


KS posted:

Well, after buying an N40L, I think I'm going to look for something more powerful. My ECC RAM is registered and won't work, and I think I can get something more powerful for the same money given that I'd need to re-buy the RAM.

My goal is a 32GB machine with enough power to act as an ESX server, and VT-D support to pass the storage through to a ZFS VM.

I'm looking for a case and PSU recommendation that's similar size to the N40L, quiet, and can take 4 3.5" drives and an SSD. I'm going to put a Supermicro x8SIL-F in it since the newer X9s also only take unbuffered RAM, unless someone has a better suggestion.

I'm going to try to sell the N40L on SA Mart, I guess -- when did Newegg start charging a 15% restocking fee? I don't think I'm going to shop anywhere but Amazon from now on.

You can call Newegg and they may waive the restocking fee.

I currently have a mini itx build with an i7 and 16 gb memory. It supports vt-d but I don't have the case for new drives yet.

Only downfall of mini itx is 2 memory dimms.

I picked up a Lian Li case. They have a few good mini irx towers made for lots of disks. One has a backplane built it.

I'll post some links when I am back at a computer.

IT Guy
Jan 12, 2010

You people drink like you don't want to live!

IT Guy posted:

I have a problem using FreeNAS.

I have a folder that has a lot of large files in it. Multiple hundreds of gigs. When I navigate to this folder, it takes about 5 seconds for the folder to populate in Windows explorer (using cifs) before I can click anything and the green loading bar or whatever it is goes across my windows explorer window as if it's loading something. Now, I have a second identical box that I use just to replicate and when I navigate to the same folder on that machine, it's instant. I have both FreeNAS machines setup identically. What could be the issue?

Here is the green bar loading the folder taking about 5 seconds to populate:



Update:

Turns out I have some SMART errors on one of my disks. During the scheduled long test of one of my drives today I was surprised to see an email from my server saying there were SMART errors with bad sectors. I'm going to attempt to remap these but this is probably why my performance is fucked.

Goon Matchmaker
Oct 23, 2003

I play too much EVE-Online

IT Guy posted:

Update:

Turns out I have some SMART errors on one of my disks. During the scheduled long test of one of my drives today I was surprised to see an email from my server saying there were SMART errors with bad sectors. I'm going to attempt to remap these but this is probably why my performance is fucked.

The disk is dead. Get it replaced ASAP before data loss occurs.

IT Guy
Jan 12, 2010

You people drink like you don't want to live!

Goon Matchmaker posted:

The disk is dead. Get it replaced ASAP before data loss occurs.

Will Hitachi replace a drive under warranty with bad sectors?

sleepy gary
Jan 11, 2006



IT Guy posted:

Will Hitachi replace a drive under warranty with bad sectors?

Bad sectors = defective drive.

I have no direct Hitachi experience with this but I have successfully RMA'd drives with bad sectors from Seagate and WD.

IT Guy
Jan 12, 2010

You people drink like you don't want to live!

Ok, question... if Hitachi refuses to replace the drive, can I use a different brand of drive (right now they're all the same models) for example, WD red drives? The 7k3000's are tough to find in Canada anymore.

DEAD MAN'S SHOE
Nov 23, 2003

We will become evil and the stars will come alive


Speaking of which can I get SMART test results through the FreeNAS web interface, and if so where?

movax
Aug 30, 2008



teamdest posted:

Finished for the moment FYI. Any recommendations?

Only nitpicks are organization + maybe add a TOC. Ideally I'd like someone to go "hey there's the NAS thread" and then get the overview they need in like 30 seconds. There are only a few different types of solutions we talk about in this thread, so I'd think those should get the first billing (I think..FreeNAS, Qnaps/Synologys? Hardware-wise, seems like N36s/N40s are the most popular for FreeNAS) and a quick blurb about each. Doesn't mean discussion should only be limited to those, I just think in the interest of not information overload, should focus the main ones first.

Under the second post, the links are good, but we could also throw some Q/A there, like "can I mix and match brands", "who has the best warranty", "what's good pricing on x drive" (this is subject to go out of date very quickly though, so maybe not a good idea). Basically the questions that come up every few pages.

And no offense meant by any of this, I'm pretty sure a few of my OPs are guilty of some of this as well.

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

So I loaded up NAS4Free on a USB stick (used Roadkil DiskImage to load NAS4Free-x64-LiveUSB-9.1.0.1.457.img), stuck it in the N40L (which also has my drives installed, of course), and got this:



(Sorry for the image quality, but I think it gets the point across)

Did I do something wrong, or am I just not clear on how to install this?

Devian666
Aug 20, 2008

Take some advice Chris.



Fun Shoe

movax posted:

And no offense meant by any of this, I'm pretty sure a few of my OPs are guilty of some of this as well.

There's always room for improving OPs. Things change and the OP should evolve over time. I took a beating on my first and only megathread.

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

Tried this after googling for some how-tos, didn't work either. Guess it's time to buy a copy of windows.

Ninja Rope
Oct 22, 2005

Wee.


You can install FreeBSD (and I assume FreeNAS/NAS4free) in vmware onto a USB stick if you don't assign the VM a hard drive and just plug in the USB stick. The installer will see the USB stick as the only HDD and will work just the same as it would on a hard drive.

Once it's installed just plug the USB stick into the N40L.

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

Ninja Rope posted:

You can install FreeBSD (and I assume FreeNAS/NAS4free) in vmware onto a USB stick if you don't assign the VM a hard drive and just plug in the USB stick. The installer will see the USB stick as the only HDD and will work just the same as it would on a hard drive.

Once it's installed just plug the USB stick into the N40L.
So ... to install linuxFreeBSD, I need to buy VMWare? That's ... kind of ridiculous.

Ninja Rope
Oct 22, 2005

Wee.


Krakkles posted:

So ... to install linuxFreeBSD, I need to buy VMWare? That's ... kind of ridiculous.

VMware player is free. Plenty of people have installed FreeBSD directly onto a USB stick. I don't know enough about the process/NAS4free/whatever to help you, I'm telling you this worked for me.

Edit: I've also had trouble with 64-gig memory sticks, Windows doesn't really like working with them. Never had problems with 8- or 16-.

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





Have you tried a different USB stick / has this one been used before? I've had a hard time before when I've used sticks that were formatted strangely by prior bootable tools.

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

IOwnCalculus posted:

Have you tried a different USB stick / has this one been used before? I've had a hard time before when I've used sticks that were formatted strangely by prior bootable tools.

I'll find another one and try it. I've been able to plug this one into a Windows 7 workstation, format it, write data to it, read it back, reformat, etc.

Edit: Trying the VMware thing as well, and trying FreeNAS too. I wasn't aware that VMware player was free, thanks for pointing that out. This is a 16GB stick, so I don't think it's the size issue mentioned.

Krakkles fucked around with this message at 01:05 on Nov 20, 2012

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





I had an 8GB stick that refused to boot (could write/read data otherwise all day long) until I used this thing to truly wipe it and start over.

Ninja Rope
Oct 22, 2005

Wee.


Yeah, copying files isn't enough. I believe it needs an MBR with a bootable partition and boot loader installed. Fortunately doing it through the freebsd installer will do all that for you, though it's slower writing things file by file as an installer will do than as large blocks like an imager will do. Oh well, you only should need to do this once.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

If you want to load the embedded version of FreeNAS 8 (I assume you do) onto a USB stick, Google can help! It seriously is pretty damned easy. NAS4Free uses a similar system, should you feel inclined to go that route. This will allow you to skip bothering with VMPlayer or pretty much anything other than a raw disk write program.

FreeNAS Embedded:
http://forums.freenas.org/showthrea...e-under-Windows

NAS4Free Embedded:
http://linhost.info/2012/09/create-...ive-in-windows/

NAS4Free Full:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/ale...ree%20on%20usb/ (grab the latest version from here, then write to USB with physdiskwrite, Win32 Disk Imager, etc. The only real reason to do this is if there are specific 3rd party packages that you want to install that play better with a full install)

e; I also see you were trying the LiveUSB option. That is still kinda experimental, and numerous people have had issues with it. If you're trying for an embedded install (that is, running it entirely off the USB stick, and without any need for 3rd party packages), use the straight-up embedded version, not the LiveUSB or LiveCD version.

DrDork fucked around with this message at 05:10 on Nov 20, 2012

KS
Jun 10, 2003


Outrageous Lumpwad

The CD version of both FreeNAS and Nas4Free include an option once booted that will do the install to another device, including a key drive. It seems to be the easiest option.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

Writing a raw .img to a USB stick isn't really any harder, and the N40L doesn't come with a CD drive pre-installed, so I'm assuming that a few clicks would be an easier solution than tossing a CD drive in for a single 5 minute operation.

Megaman
May 8, 2004
I didn't read the thread BUT...

What is the least amount of drives to be most efficient in raidz2/3? I've heard differing arguments, but I believe someone mentioned 12 for z3? Can someone point me to information or a doc on this?

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003



The most efficient (for space) is the maximum vdev size.

joe944
Jan 31, 2004

What does not destroy me makes me stronger.


Megaman posted:

What is the least amount of drives to be most efficient in raidz2/3? I've heard differing arguments, but I believe someone mentioned 12 for z3? Can someone point me to information or a doc on this?

I believe the 'optimum' size for a raidz2 vdev is 6-12 disks and a raidz3 vdev is 9-15.

Thermopyle
Jul 1, 2003

...the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. —Bertrand Russell



Megaman posted:

What is the least amount of drives to be most efficient in raidz2/3? I've heard differing arguments, but I believe someone mentioned 12 for z3? Can someone point me to information or a doc on this?

According to this

quote:

Start a single-parity RAIDZ (raidz) configuration at 3 disks (2+1)
Start a double-parity RAIDZ (raidz2) configuration at 6 disks (4+2)
Start a triple-parity RAIDZ (raidz3) configuration at 9 disks (6+3)
(N+P) with P = 1 (raidz), 2 (raidz2), or 3 (raidz3) and N equals 2, 4, or 6
The recommended number of disks per group is between 3 and 9. If you have more disks, use multiple groups.

I'm not sure exactly how authoritative that is, but I do know the official Oracle docs link to that document.

Devian666
Aug 20, 2008

Take some advice Chris.



Fun Shoe

It looks like a good set of guidelines. Though at 4 or 5 disks I'd be itching to go to z2.

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

Just wanted to come back and say that Ninja Rope's suggestions worked fine, I installed FreeNAS, and currently have 3.45TB of storage that makes me feel much safer. I'm backing up my Macbook Pro to wireless Time Machine and moving my Lightroom catalog over as we speak, and getting quite nice speed.

Thanks, guys! Now to figure out this printer sharing thing ... fuck it, I might just connect that to my desktop and call it a day.

Keep reading. You literally linked to the same exact page that I did.

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

Krakkles posted:

Keep reading. You literally linked to the same exact page that I did.
I know. Your initial problem was very likely trying to use a LiveUSB image instead of the Embedded image, which I noted. In any event, as long as you got it worked out in the end.

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

Possibly dumb FreeNAS question: I went through google, looking for how to set up email notifications (I want it to email me if a drive starts failing or something, basically) and found this:

http://forums.freenas.org/showthrea...fication-how-to

I ran through that, and was able to get the test email sent out to myself. What I'm not seeing is whether there's anything else I need to do to actually get ALERTS sent. Is that just assumed?

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

Make sure you've also set up the SMART testing the way you want it. If a drive fails a SMART test, it will then email you. Otherwise you'll just get a nightly email with the status of your rig, which will include notes about any drives that have failed/are missing/whatever. However, there is currently no built-in way to get an automatic notification the instant a problem like that crops up. You'd have to set up a script or something for that.

ClassH
Mar 18, 2008


Good deal on amazon today. 3TB seagate 7200 for $109. I got one previously and hit 200MB/S with just the one drive.
http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-Barra...rds=seagate+3tb

Fatal
Jul 29, 2004

I'm gunna kill you BITCH!!!


ClassH posted:

Good deal on amazon today. 3TB seagate 7200 for $109. I got one previously and hit 200MB/S with just the one drive.
http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-Barra...rds=seagate+3tb

Was just about to post this Bought 8, my NAS is almost there! Just need the CPU.

Pweller
Jan 25, 2006

Whatever whateva.

ClassH posted:

Good deal on amazon today. 3TB seagate 7200 for $109. I got one previously and hit 200MB/S with just the one drive.
http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-Barra...rds=seagate+3tb

Showing up as $89.99 for me!

$109.99 here for any pricematching Canadians

Pweller fucked around with this message at 18:59 on Nov 21, 2012

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